They Reminisce Over You Podcast

Lil' Kim & Foxy Brown cover art for episode 19 of the They Reminisce Over You Podcast

Aug 31, 2021

Episode 19: Lil' Kim & Foxy Brown - aka Thelma & Louise

Episode Summary

Continuing our series on beefs in hip hop, this week we'll be getting into Lil Kim & Foxy Brown. We don't know the REAL reason for the beef, we just know that it's been going on for YEARS, and is showing no signs of ending anytime soon.


Christina: Welcome back to They Reminisce Over You. I’m Christina

Miguel: And I’m Miguel. This episode, we’re continuing our series on beefs in hip hop. Last time we talked about Nas and Jay-Z and their decade long beef, and this time we’re going to be talking about Foxy Brown and Lil’ Kim.

Christina: Also decades long beef.

Miguel: Yes. And still—they’re like on their second decade now.

Christina: Yeah. We’ll be getting into that.

Miguel: It’s been awhile. You ready to just jump into it?

Christina: Let’s do it.

So… to tell you the truth, I mean, I knew they had beef, but I never really knew…specifics.

Miguel: Well, that seems to be—

Christina: I just knew they didn’t like each other.

Miguel: Yeah, that seems to be the case with everybody.

Christina: Yeah. So even just trying to find, um, like how it started, the background—everyone’s just kind of basically saying the same thing and it’s… kind of leads to we don’t really know much. So this is pretty much all I could find, was…you know, they’ve known each other for a while, even went to the same high school for a little while. But Lil’ Kim’s like, I don’t know, like three, four years older than Foxy. So Lil’ Kim was probably on her way out as Foxy was coming in. But, you know, they’ve known each other since they were teenagers, they seemed friendly. They even did a song together, the “No One Else[1],” Total remix. So this is like ’95 now. And then both of their albums came out in ’96, a week apart from each other. They appeared on The Source together[2]. Although…

Miguel: Right.

Christina: They appeared in The Source together, but they were interviewed separately.

Miguel: Yes.

Christina: But, for the most part, up until ’97, they seemed friendly. They seemed to have nice things to say to each other, in public at least. But then Def Jam CEO at the time, Lyor Cohen, had offered them a deal to do a Thelma and Louise album together, which one, or both turned down. And that’s sort of when people were like, huh, there’s gotta be a reason why one would turn down money. [Laughs]

Miguel: Yes.

Christina: He allegedly offered $500K to each of them to, to do the album. So, you know, that’s a nice chunk to turn down.

Miguel: It is, especially in ’97.

Christina: Yeah. So that was when people started thinking, hey, maybe these two don’t like each other.

Miguel: And still, we have no idea why. There’s a couple of theories, but nothing solid. Like the, the first theory is from their album cover. Like they both have on the same outfit[3] on the inside of each of their album covers. Uh, I think her name is Kim Osorio[4], that used to write for The Source, she couldn’t confirm it, but she also says that someone told her that one borrowed it from the other and never returned it.

Christina: And then wore it in the album.

Miguel: Yeah, that sounds like some hip hop folklore shit, because they’re not the same size. Like Foxy Brown is, or at the time, wasn’t a very big woman. Lil’ Kim was way too small, so I don’t see them wearing the same outfit. So I can’t buy that theory.

Christina: Well, I mean, they were wearing the same outfit but not necessarily the…literal…

Miguel: Yeah. But not the exact physical copy. [Both laugh] Yeah. Like the same outfit.

Christina: Cause Lil’ Kim’s tiny. I mean, not that Foxy is big, but she’s like a, average size woman, she’s taller. Whereas, Lil’ Kim is like, short.

Miguel: Yeah. She’s much taller. So there’s no way they fit the very same outfit. They have the same outfit in that both of them have it. But not this one outfit that they were sharing.

Christina: Like literally sharing clothes.

Miguel: Yeah. So I don’t know if I buy that one as much.

Christina: And especially since the albums came out pretty much at the same time, it couldn’t be like one saw it and… unless maybe, they had accidentally had the same stylist? But then still that wouldn’t make sense because why would the stylist put them in the same outfit?

Miguel: Yeah. I’m thinking that it was a hot outfit for the time. It was probably something brand new. And whoever the stylist was, the buyer who gave it to 'em was like, nobody else has this. And then the other one’s stylist comes in, nobody else has this. And they both ended up wearing it on the album.

Christina: It happens. Hey, I have some friends where we’ve ended up buying the same thing unexpectedly. It happens. [Laughs]

Miguel: So, I don’t know if I buy that theory of them sharing one outfit and the other one was pissed off.

Christina: Well, the other theory sounds more plausible. Which was Foxy was allegedly supposed to be part of Junior M.A.F.I.A. I can’t remember who I saw in an interview talking about this.

Miguel: Uh, probably Clark Kent.

Christina: Ah, yes. And he said that Kim was upset and they ended up having a fight at Daddy-O’s studios. He seems like a reliable source.

Miguel: Yes, because he basically helped find Junior M.A.F.I.A and Biggie. And he’s Foxy Brown’s cousin. So if anybody has any idea of what’s going on, he would be the best bet.

Christina: Cause knows both of them quite well. [Laughs]

Miguel: But I also read that he’s never asked either of them what the problem was.

Christina: See, I’m so mad 'cause I lost my notes, as I told you, cause I had the link to the interview where he was talking about this, but somehow deleted my notes. But he said he felt bad for not—never really asking, but he didn’t want to ask, because he had ties with both them so he just kind of wanted to stay out of it.

Miguel: But if anybody would know, he would be the closest one, other than Kim and Foxy themselves.

Christina: Well obviously, yeah. So that one sounds more plausible. And I also think, you know, they both came out at the same time. They’re both women, you know, people are just going to compare. Just the usual, you breed the competition, just kind of don’t like each other. And maybe after a while, they get tired of being compared to each other and whatnot. So could be mix of maybe all of that.

Miguel: Yeah. because their careers were kind of like in parallel, too. They came out at the same time. Like, Kim was doing “Get Money” and “Players Anthem.” At the same time, Foxy Brown is doing, “I Shot Ya” with LL and “Touch Me, Tease Me” and “Ain’t No Nigga.” So their careers were actually trending at the same time and at the same pace. And like you said, the albums came out a week apart. So just that alone is going to create some competition.

Christina: Yeah. And they sort of had the similar style in the sense that they were both young, both like, very sexy and stuff. So it’s kind of natural that people would just compare them.

Miguel: Yeah. And they were both put on by 1A and 1B of New York hip hop with Biggie and Jay-Z.

Christina: Exactly.

Miguel: So there’s a lot of layers to it. My personal opinion, I think it is, like you mentioned, the Junior M.A.F.I.A. thing. Because apparently Foxy was in Junior M.A.F.I.A. first, when Daddy-O was putting them together. And for whatever reason, they decided that they wanted Kim rather than Foxy. I could see that being like, some animosity and some jealousy there, even though she ended up getting put on by Clark with Jay Z and whatnot. So I could see that being some, I don’t like her.

Christina: Yeah. And again, remember they were very young, too. Like, Foxy was like 14 when she started working with Jay Z, I think, right? Like she was 14-15 when she recorded—

Miguel: I think she was 15 when it came out.

Christina: Right. And then Lil’ Kim, maybe, she was—I think she was 19 when her album so she must have been, you know, 17 or so when this was all started. So just think of how you were in high school, right. [Laughs]

Miguel: Exactly. This is literally high school girls beefing with each other. And it just happens to be—

Christina: Yeah, like the popular girls you know, the pretty popular girls that everybody is like “she’s prettier than you” and whatever. Like, you know, you kind of forget how young they were. Because especially since it’s been going on for so long. And then we were young at the time too so them being young didn’t seem any different from us being young.

Miguel: Exactly.

Christina: It’s like, we’re all grown. Duh. [Laughs] But now you look back and you’re like, they were teenagers. Literal teenagers.

Miguel: Couldn’t even buy alcohol legally.

Alright. So nothing really popped off, at least on the music level, until two years later, when Kim did a verse on “Play Around[1:1].” And here’s a quick side bar, your man Harve Pierre—

Christina: I knew you were going to bring him up. [Laughs]

Miguel: He is reckless with these hooks. So you got the, “You don’t want to play around, play around with me. Oh boy. I’ll kill you.”

Christina: "I’ll kill you!” [Laughs]

Miguel: [Laughing] So he’s got that one. The, uh, the Black Rob one. You know the one.

Christina: I dare—no.

Miguel: Yes. “I dare you. To come against me.”

Christina: But because of Desus and Mero, The Bodega Boys podcast, I can only remember Mero’s version and not the real version. [Both laugh]

Miguel: Yeah, he was out here doing some wild shit with these hooks. There’s one on G-Dep’s album. Like, come on, you just real reckless with this. But anyway, back to the Lil’ Kim and Foxy beef. So she does that verse and also again on the “Notorious K.I.M.” song.

Christina: Actually when we go back to, the Lil’ Cease song, “Play Around.” I was listening to her verse, I don’t know, to me, it just sounded so generic because most of the stuff I was reading more pointed towards Diddy saying… what’d he say?

Miguel: “Stop trying to sound like her, bitches.” Yeah.

Christina: So it seemed like everybody was pointing more towards Diddy, kind of like, in case you don’t know who she’s talking about, I guess. Cause to me, when I just heard the song, I was like, I would not have really thought…

Miguel: Which goes back to what I said…

Christina: …anything of it.

Miguel: during that Source Awards episode[5], Diddy is always throwing stones and trying to hide his hand. I don’t know why everybody is saying I’m starting shit. It’s because you out here starting shit. That’s why.

Christina: Yeah, 'cause like I said, everything I read was like, and Diddy said this, rather than Kim said this. Like, I just said, I tried to listen to her verse and I’m like, I don’t hear it. Like I would have not have listened to this and said, oh, she coming for Foxy.

Miguel: And that tends to be the case with a lot of these diss tracks. It’s—a lot of it is never direct. It’s always somebody assuming that these lines are about them.

Christina: Hit dogs holler, as they say. Because especially with rap music, part of it is the bravado, part of it is that I’m better than all of you. So, it can be generic, I guess, but it can you know, if it hits, it hits.

Miguel: Yeah. well, on the other side of that, a lot of these are directed to people, but they just don’t want to come out and say it the same time. So, it goes both ways.

Christina: Yeah. Okay. So then back to Notorious K.I.M.[1:2] In 2000, that one…she seemed to have something more specific to say. She said, “this chick running around that stink ass gap,” blah, blah, blah, blah. There’s more—it still sounds generic, but it does at the same time sound like she’s talking about somebody.

Miguel: And if you want it to fit Foxy Brown, it could.

Christina: Right. So she’s like “you ain’t a star, your record company knows that.” So I can’t remember…this was 2000, so I don’t know if there was any like, label issues at the time with Foxy. I was trying to look it up, but I couldn’t tell because I–

Miguel: Not that I remember.

Christina: Yeah. So I don’t know if she just said that to say that, or if they were actually some record label issues.

Miguel: Yeah, not that I’m aware of.

Christina: So then that came out, which resulted in Foxy coming back with a verse on Capone and Noreaga’s, “Bang, Bang.”[1:3] So this was extremely direct.

Miguel: It was.

Christina: This one, there is no trying to figure out who’s talking about what.

Miguel: Right.

Christina: Because she actually called out, "You and Diddy/Y’all kill me with that subliminal shit.”

Miguel: Like I said about his Source Awards stuff.

Christina: Yeah. There’s more in the song, but that was the line that was like, alright. We know exactly who she’s talking about.

Miguel: It was like, there are no questions anymore. She’s talking about Kim and Diddy. And that leads to a shooting outside of Hot 97.

Christina: Hot 97, always in the mix.

Miguel: They are. And, that’s when somebody in Kim’s crew shot at somebody in the Capone and Noreaga crew. He gets hit in the back. Police show up. Kim’s like, I don’t know nothing. I wasn’t with these dudes. I wasn’t even here. I just got here.

Christina: So basically, she was upstairs doing an interview and Capone and Noreaga, actually Noreaga wasn’t there. It was just Capone and some of their crew was coming in, cause they were supposed to come in and do an interview or something after. And then Kim’s crew had some words for them because Foxy’s “Bang, Bang” verse…

Miguel: Was on their album.

Christina: So that was how that sparked and then the shooting happened. Which then, as you were saying, Kim’s like, I wasn’t there. I wasn’t there, so-and-so wasn’t there. And so-and-so wasn’t there.

Miguel: [Laughing] Even though there’s video of all three of them standing there.

Christina: Yep.

Miguel: In front of the station.

Christina: So she didn’t want to rat on her friends. I guess she thought she was protecting them, but that didn’t work out too well for her.

Miguel: [Laughing] It did not.

Christina: Foxy’s like, I ain’t got nothing to do with this.

Miguel: This is not me. I may have started it with my lyrics, but I wasn’t there.

Christina: Yeah. Cause she wasn’t even there. And she says she tried to get Russell Simmons who, because she was at Def Jam at the time and well, so was he, to help her extend an olive branch to Lil’ Kim and Kim was like…nah. [Both laugh]

Miguel: I don’t want nothing to do with you, bitch.

Christina: So I think, from what I could gather, Lil’ Kim just did not respond. So this was in 2001, but the law takes a long time.

Miguel: Right.

Christina: So she ended up getting sentenced for perjury[6] in 2005 stemming from this. But, she did get a little reality TV show out of this.

Miguel: She did.

Christina: Countdown to Lockdown.

Miguel: I remember watching it at the time, but I don’t remember anything about it.

Christina: Yeah, I can’t remember if I watched the whole thing but I remember it. And so this just covered her last 14 days before going into prison. So she was sentenced to a year in a day for lying about people’s whereabouts that day. [Laughs]

Miguel: When you’re on video tape. I wasn’t there. Okay, Kimberly.

Christina: I re-watched a clip[7] where she was at a reshooting her “Lighters Up” video. And she showed up to the set, like four or five hours late or something. And then the footage that I saw them shoot, I’m like this isn’t in the “Lighters Up” video. So that leads me to believe that they ended up reshooting the “Lighters Up” video again anyway. But yeah, there’s clips and stuff floating around on the internet if you want to see Kim’s 14 days before lockdown.

Miguel: I will, just to have it spark some memories. Cause I did watch it when it came on. I just don’t remember anything about it right now because old.

Christina: Anyways, so that’s that.

Miguel: I was watching a video of Capone, I think it might have been when he was on Drink Champs,[8] and he was talking about the shooting. And he mentioned how that shooting happened and then a couple of years later, the exact same thing happened with The Game and 50 Cent, when they had their shooting outside of Hot 97 as well with the G-Unit and the “G-Unot”[9] crews.

He said that all Hot 97 has to do is book these groups two hours apart, instead of having them coming back to back, just so you can have them on the air immediately after one leaves. He’s like all of that could have been just handled differently and no one would’ve got shot, no one would have gone to jail if you just book them separately or have them come through two different entrances. He’s like everybody’s coming in and out of the same door and it happened twice. So they, they played a role in it as well.

Christina: I think that that might’ve been the same interview too, or another one he was talking about how him and Lil’ Cease were talking about it. Cause you know, Lil’ Cease was there when Tupac got shot. And then he was there with the Lil’ Kim and C-N-N shooting. He was just like, not again. [Laughs]

Miguel: And him and Kim didn’t speak for years after that either. Like they recently just started talking again.[10] Maybe, two years ago.

Christina: Why?

Miguel: Because he had to testify and apparently he was like, “Yeah, Kim was there.” And so she stopped talking to Lil’ Cease and they didn’t speak till like, either last year or two years ago.

Christina: He’s like, I ain’t perjuring myself.

Miguel: Right. [Both laugh]

Christina: But how could she say she’s not there if she was there doing an interview?

Miguel: That’s the problem. Everybody knew she was there and they had video footage[11] from like security cameras across the street and in the building. Like we know you were there. Well, I guess she thought she could get away with it.

Christina: “We gon’ ride on this lie!”[12] [Laughs]

Miguel: Basically. That’s exactly what it was. She’s like, nobody going to jail today. We weren’t here. We recorded that two weeks ago.

Christina: Well, interestingly enough, around the same time that Kim was getting ready to go to the big house, Foxy suddenly lost her hearing. [Miguel laughs] Right. Why are you laughing? Ooooh, wait!

Miguel: [Laughing] Are you saying that Lil’ Kim had something to do with Foxy’s hearing?

Christina: You know what? No, no, no, I wasn’t. [Laughing] But I remember just seeing random tweets and someone said that Lil’ Kim put a hex on her. [Both laugh]

I don’t know if this was just a joke or if this was some kind of actual like, rumor or story. But now–I just made the connection right now when I said that. Maybe she did put a hex on her. Because she just woke, she says she literally woke up one day and could not hear shit. [Laughs]

Miguel: Yeah.

Christina: [Laughing] At the same time, Lil’ Kim is going to jail.

Miguel: I didn’t realize it was at the same time.

Christina: I didn’t until literally just now, I’m looking at my notes. I’m like, oh, both of it says 2005. So this is a good thing to point out.

Miguel: See they’re, they’re connected. Whether they want to be or not, they are connected.

You said Lil’ Kim did a year and a day. And like a year later is when Foxy had her surgery and had her hearing fixed. So, maybe there’s something to it. I’m not going to say that it didn’t happen. I just can’t prove that it did.

Christina: Yeah, cause her hearing was restored about a year later. From what I read, she still does have to wear hearing aids though. I’m kind of jumping ahead now, but that might make sense in regards to that performance we were watching yesterday. She did a performance a couple of years ago on Kandi’s… one of Kandi’s tours.

Miguel: Yeah, the Welcome to the Dungeon tour[13] or something like that.

Christina: And she was just performing really erratically. And the DJ was saying how she showed up late, didn’t come to soundcheck and stuff. So some of that could play into it, but it also looked very obvious like she was getting cues from her hype man. And she was like, rapping the wrong lyrics to the wrong song. So to me it looks like she may still have some hearing issues.

Miguel: That’s what I’m thinking, because just like in the video, when you can see him kind of give her a cue. It’s the song with her and Blackstreet. And she starts talking about Total.

Christina: “Shout out to my girls, Total.”

Miguel: And rapping a completely different song.[14] And then she kind of looks at him for a little bit and he gives her a cue and he starts rapping the words. And then she jumps over to the Blackstreet song. So it seems like they’ve got some things worked out where she can read the lips and figure out where she is with the song, but she can’t really hear, because like you said, it was really strange performance.

Christina: Yeah. Cause it’s one thing to forget lyrics. It’s one thing to have to rap over your own vocals. Like people do that, but she was…

Miguel: Just disoriented it seems.

Christina: She looked disoriented and she was totally doing like, doing the correct verse for the wrong song. Like she was doing the correct verse for the Total song when was shouting out Total, but it was the Blackstreet song that was playing. And then she was able to just go right into where they were at that point in Blackstreet song.

Miguel: Like she jumped right into it. So it’s not like she actually forgot the words.

Christina: So she knows the words.

Miguel: She was just on the wrong song.

Christina: And he had to come and tap her basically. So, I don’t know. There seems to be maybe some issues with her hearing still. Although she hasn’t really said anything about that.

Miguel: Yeah. I’m thinking there’s some residual issues from that.

Christina: Yeah. And probably doesn’t help when you don’t do soundcheck either. [Laughs]

Miguel: Yeah. Cause if you have to do those types of things just to perform, you should practice it.

Christina: Yeah.

Miguel: You just can’t show up and all right. I’m ready.

Christina: Yeah. So not really sure what’s going on with that. As much as the two of them have done many interviews and people ask them about it, it’s just kind of a mystery other than they don’t like each other.

Miguel: Yeah. Like for years it died down and then just like again, in 2010 or something, it flares up again, just out of nowhere.

Christina: 2011

Miguel: 2011, 2010, somewhere in there.

Christina: Foxy comes out with some freestyle or—it’s called “Massacre”[15] and it sounds so bad.

Miguel: It does.

Christina: Like just the way it’s mixed and it sounds like she’s rapping underwater or something. Like it was so garbled that I couldn’t even really hear what she was saying. So I like, I can’t even be like “bars!”[16] cause I have no idea. And the thing is, it had these random gunshots through it, so they needed to like, turn her vocals up. So I couldn’t turn it up to hear her vocals, cause if I did, I’d hear gunshots in my ears really loudly. So I’m like, I don’t know what to say, but I don’t know if this was good. Maybe I need to find like a lyrics video or something.

Miguel: I’m sure there’s one out there.

Christina: Yeah. It just sounded bad. Like not just the garbled vocals, but like, it just sounded like she recorded it in a basement or something.

Miguel: Yeah, it’s not very good. She just decided to jump in when Nicki Minaj and Lil’ Kim started beefing.[17] And of course she sided with Nicki.

Christina: Of course.

Miguel: Just because if you’re anti Kim, I’m pro you.

Christina: Yeah.

Miguel: So…

Christina: Either you with me or you against me, but it’s the opposite. I dunno, whatever, you know what I mean? [Laughs]

Miguel: So Yeah just 10 years later here they are beefing again.

Christina: Yeah. So of course Lil’ Kim had to be a little shady about it, when somebody asked her—so in an interview with,,[18] they asked her, "Foxy Brown released a diss record, aimed at you called Massacre. What did you think of that? Did you hear it?” [Miguel laughs]

This is what she said: “I don’t think she heard it. I don’t even, I couldn’t even, you know what, next question. That was the biggest joke of the industry ever. Hilarious. I don’t understand it.” Wooooow. [Both laugh]

Miguel: Oh, man.

Christina: I mean, honestly, that is probably the best line out of all these quote-unquote diss tracks. [Laughs]

Miguel: I think so. Yeah. Although “Bang, Bang” was good.

Christina: It was.

Miguel: That though, it was good. It’s a good zinger.

Christina: Yeah. And that’s just a little one-off comment.

Miguel: Right?

Christina: In an interview.

Miguel: Uh, so in 2013, Fabolous was performing at the Hot 97 Summer Jam and he wanted to bring the both of them out to perform and finally put this whole thing to bed. They both agreed to it. And Foxy, allegedly showed up late. So she didn’t get a chance to perform. That’s what Fab told everybody, that she showed up late. So she couldn’t perform. Foxy says she decided not to do it because she felt it was fake.[19] So she just thought it was not on like, legit terms for them to be out here, making up after all these years. It was just done for publicity.

Christina: Yeah, cause she said they hadn’t even talked before that.

Miguel: Yeah, I get that portion of it. But at the same time, y’all are adults now. You both have children.

Yeah. Even if it is on some fake shit, you don’t have to be best friends after. They just come out, do a hug and go on both sides of the stage.

Christina: If Monica and Brandy can do a Verzuz together when Monica allegedly punched Brandy in the face.[20]

Miguel: In the face. Allegedly.

Christina: Before they performed together what was it, the Grammys?

Miguel: I don’t know which show it was.

Christina: One of these awards shows. If I can perform with the person who punched me in the face.

Miguel: Two minutes ago. These two can just come out and get fake hugs and then go back to talking shit about each other.

Christina: And get paid.

Miguel: Each say, we’ve grown up, we’ve moved on. I got nothin to say about her. She’s got nothing to say about me. And that’s where we are.

Christina: I can’t remember now what Foxy was referring to, but I did watch another interview where she was trying to do something with Lil’ Kim. And she said, Lil’ Kim said, I don’t want to. And then her last words was “typical." [Both laugh]

Miguel: Come on now, just over it.

Christina: Yeah. I don’t know. It was confusing,

Miguel: This whole thing is confusing.

Christina: To me, it doesn’t feel like a typical rap beef, even though they have songs.

Miguel: This is definitely personal.

Christina: Yeah, this is just like, I don’t like her. That’s it. [Laughs]

Miguel: I don’t think we’ll ever get the actual truth. It’s been this long and neither of them has said it. So I don’t think we’ll ever find out why they were beefing.

Christina: And it seems like now, in the last 10 years or so, it seems to be more on Foxy’s side that is keeping it going. Because in 2020, when Nas released his first, what’s the album called? King’s Disease, the first one. And he did a song with The Firm and so she had a verse on it and I saw that she had made some like shady Instagram post[21] said something like you had 10 years to make a hit. And I’m out here with one verse and everyone’s talking about me.

Miguel: Oh, man, just let it go.

Christina: Which is kind of like everyone’s response. Well, half the people are like, yeah, Foxy’s back! And the other half is like, you getting too old for this shit. [Laughs]

Miguel: Just let it go, man.

Christina: Oh, wait. I do have it written down. She said “Gave bitches 10 years and they ain’t drop a single bop! One verse streets on tilt! Mic down bitches.”

Miguel: No man, stop.

Christina: The song is called “Tilt.”[22]

Miguel: Just stop.

Christina: But, you know what? I thought maybe because that Massacre freestyle was just mixed so badly, I thought maybe that’s why her voice sounded so weird. But even on the “Full Circle” song…

Miguel: No, she just sounds a lot different than she used to.

Christina: It just has this kind of like "warbly" sound. I don’t—did the hearing affect her voice?

Miguel: I think it’s just like, age and lifestyle.

Christina: Maybe she hasn’t been taking care of her vocals.

Miguel: Yeah. It could be a huge variety of reasons.

Christina: 'Cause she used to have like a throaty, deeper voice.

Miguel: Yeah.

Christina: Although, ok, now I’m going to bring it back a little bit. When Diddy was like, “stop trying to sound like her, bitches.”

Miguel: She did change then.

Christina: She did, I did notice on the second album that her voice changed, but I never thought that she changed it to sound like Lil’ Kim though. I just noticed a voice change.

Miguel: I can see it. I can see why someone would say that she’s trying to take Kim’s style.

Christina: Well, I think now I can see it because I was listening to both of their albums back to back. And I’m like, okay, I guess I can hear it now, but at the time I didn’t think anything of it. Yeah, so technically we could say they had a beef, but I can’t really say like, who won because this isn’t really a competition. It’s just two people that don’t like each other.

Miguel: Hate each other for whatever reason. Cause I was just going to ask if you had a favorite song of…

Christina: I don’t.

Miguel: …what happened. Me neither because it’s like, ehh.

Christina: And then the, the songs that they had where they did like, dig at each other, I don’t like any of those. I like their other songs.

Miguel: Right. But the songs that they’re talking about each other, were just, ehh.

Like the closest one to it would be the “Bang, Bang” for me, but I just don’t like the song.

Christina: Yeah, same.

Miguel: So, that’s probably as close as it’s going to get.

Christina: Yeah, the only way I could say I can pick a winner is if I look at their body of work. So in listening to this stuff back to back are realize that I listened to more of Foxy’s albums. Whereas I listen to more of Kim’s singles. So if I had to pick who I liked better, I came to the conclusion overall, I liked Foxy Brown better. In terms of, like I said, I would listen to more of her full albums. Whereas with Lil’ Kim, I found that I liked singles more than a full album.

Miguel: Well, it was that way with me, but I didn’t like full albums with Foxy Brown either. With both of them, I just liked the hits. Like, the album stuff really didn’t do much for me.

Christina: I liked her first and her third as full albums. So the first album, Ill Na Na, and then the third album[23] had much more of like the reggae / West Indian style to it, but it really suits her too. I think after that I kind of stopped paying attention.

Miguel: So just based on the songs we’ve listened to and some of the mixed songs that were terrible and some of the songs that were mixed well, and just weren’t good. I can’t choose a winner in this.

Christina: Yeah.

Miguel: And I guess you can’t either.

Christina: I can’t.

Miguel: So, if you guys want, you can just listen to the playlist[1:4] that we’re putting together, listen to all the songs and you too can be confused like we are and just go back and listen to that old shit. Like Rihanna’s cousin says to, to kind of cleanse your palette.

Christina: Yeah. The only way I could pick who won this beef is just to pick who you like better because the actual diss tracks were, ehh, on both sides.

Miguel: Yeah. They didn’t do anything.

Christina: Same.

Miguel: So we’re going to end this episode here. And as we mentioned before, this is the second in a series of episodes we’re going to do about a hip hop beefs. I’m not sure which one we’re going to do next, but stay tuned and we’ll have more for you. So we’re just going to end here. You got anything to say before we head out?

Christina: Um… not really.

Miguel: Okay.

Christina: [Laughing] I was going to say, bring the beefs back. I don’t know.

Miguel: Somebody chose violence tonight.

Christina: Well… yeah. [Both laugh]

Miguel: On that note, we are going to get out of here and as always, thank you for listening. Make sure to rate, review and subscribe and check us out on your podcast service of choice and, yeah. Just hang out with us and be patient and come back and see us in like two weeks or so.

Christina: Why are you telling them to be patient?

Miguel: I don’t know. Maybe they want–

Christina: We’ve always done it every two weeks.

Miguel: I know, but maybe somebody wants something next week. That’s all.

Christina: Okay.

Miguel: They gotta be patient wait two weeks.

Christina: Alright.

Miguel: Alright. Bye.

Christina: Bye.